By Walt Garlington for the Saker Blog
The existential questions regarding the future of the present American union continue to grow more complex and more dire:
Can nationalism restore unity and purpose?
At the heart of these questions and others like them is a problem that has plagued the States since their independence in 1776: the belief that a political ideology is enough to create a homogenous cultural identity. Early on, Thomas Jefferson was writing about an ‘extensive’ ‘empire of liberty’; John Adams, about America as mankind’s second chance at the paradise of Eden. These strands of political mysticism merged into a messianic melody sung into existence by Abraham Lincoln in his Gettysburg Address in which the cause of union and its preservation became a sacred act that all future generations of Americans must take part in if representative government is to remain and ‘not perish from the face of the earth.’
Our eyes have been full of the stars of these philosophical dreams for many years. Until lately – when the weakness of a political creed as a foundation for a lasting culture is being exposed. But this is to our benefit as we can now place the emphasis where it should have been all along: on the various regional cultures that exist within the United States. These have a lasting character; it is on these that we should build our future.
Certain books are foundational for beginning this process of rebuilding, as they reveal the origins and the durable characteristics of those who settled the various regions (reviews of some of these books are linked):
Albion’s Seed by David H. Fischer;
The Nine Nations of North America by Joel Garreau;
American Nations by Colin Woodard; and
Regionalism and Nationalism in the United States: The Attack on Leviathan by Donald Davidson, which made Dr Russell Kirk’s list of ten essential conservative books – high praise indeed.
Through works like these we can begin to see the main cultural materials with which we can build: for New England, the traditions of the east of England (Essex, East Anglia); for the South, the traditions of southwest England (Wessex, etc.), the borderlands of Scotland and England, Northern Ireland, and parts of Africa, France, and Spain; for the Great Plains, the German and Scandinavian cultures; for the desert Southwest, Spanish is a major influence; Hawai’i carries the traditions of the native Pacific islanders, and on from there.
A unified culture is what gives rise to a unified nation, tribe, society, etc. This is what the regions possess, but it is precisely what the United States taken together have always lacked. To the extent that there is such a thing, it is, as Dr. Clark Carlton once said in one of his Faith and Philosophy podcasts (which sadly seem to have disappeared into the cyberspace ether), merely the vapid secular consumerism that overtook all the States after New England and her northern children won the victory in the War between the States. If we add to this the political mysticism mentioned above, we will be very close to the definition of that sad little creature called ‘American culture’.
The idea of separating the current union into smaller, regional confederations is not new. Below is a list of some past proposals to that end provided by Mr Terry Hulsey:
• The Vermont Republic (1777)
• The New York proposal by its Senator Rufus King and Oliver Ellsworth to dissolve the Union (1794)
• Opponents of Jefferson’s 1803 Louisiana Purchase, notably Josiah Quincy III
• The New England secessionists during the War of 1812
• The Hartford secessionists and their supporters in the Essex Junto (1814-15)
• The secessionism of Federalist and former President John Quincy Adams (1839)
• Abolitionist William Lloyd Garrison and the New England Anti-Slavery Conventions (1834, 1844, 1858)
• The proposed secession of five Middle Atlantic states (1860).
But if the union is to remain in existence, it should be reformed such that it resembles much more the Articles of Confederation or the United Nations, a federation in which the coordinating authority has few powers that it can wield over the region-nations that are part of it, and in which each of those participating will have a veto that it can use to stop any action – legislative, executive, or judicial – from going into effect.
Such a sweeping decentralization (or separation) will yield great benefits at home and abroad. Domestically, it will help put an end to the deeply polarizing cultural battles that constantly inflame anger and tension between the progressive cultures of New England and the West Coast and the more conservative/traditional cultures of the South and Midwest; each region would be able to decide those matters for herself rather than facing the prospect of one or more of the other sections forcing its beliefs about drug legalization, transgender rights, law and order, abortion, etc., upon her.
Internationally, it would help reduce the risk of needless wars by taking out of geopolitics the hegemonic-messianic behavior of the swaggering Indispensable Nation that has tasked itself with converting all the world to its liberal, democratic creed.
Yes, the regional cultures which we have written about have grown very faint after decades of living within the corrosive atmosphere of liberalism. Yet the alternative – attempting to trudge along under the existing paradigm – is worse, for it is a fantastical chimera based on false and failing economic, political, and religious ideas. But our forefathers in these various cultural spaces have left us with plenty of material to help us in our work of restoration: poems, novels, histories, biographies, theological works, geographies, music, recipes, and the like. With these and with a determined will and God’s help (for He is a God of Resurrection), each section can nurse its native life back to health.
The end of the current union seems inevitable for a number of reasons: The instability inherent in the ideology of selfish individualism that reigns in most parts of it; the plans of the globalist technocrats to dismantle it, as detailed by their spokesmen like Jacques Attali in his book A Brief History of the Future; prophecies by Orthodox Saints like the holy Elder Ephraim of Arizona; and so on. Prudence would have us prepare properly to meet this event that seems likely to occur, rather than be caught flat-footed as the maelstrom approaches.
The advantages of reinvigorated regionalism are many; the drawbacks are few. Let the Great Reorganization begin.
Interesting ideas. But the globalists will never relax their grip willingly, and collapse is highly unlikely. Our overlords would nerve gas a state and blame it on neon-nazi white supremacists before they’d let it leave the union.
Don’t deny the obvious:Politics in America is based upon race….And always will be.
The highly racialized majority nonwhite Democratic Party will always be openly about race. And eventually, Native Born White Americans will be openly about race-based politics. And this explains why theorems on Super-agreeability are irrelevant.
So what comes next: Partition based upon race. But Native Born White Working Class Americans with high probability will see this as invasion and colonization of the Nation their ancestors built and died for.
I have great doubts that the breakup of the US will be peaceful…
Tucker Carlson fantasizes that America will transcend race-based politics…but this is pure fantasy. The Historic Native Born White Working Class Majority may not consent to putting their fate in the hands of the highly racialized majority nonwhite Democratic Party Voting Bloc.
If Tulsi Gabbard is ever elected POTUS…well, Tulsi is a fanatical supporter of the H1-L1B Visa Program…a vicious Democratic Party Labor Policy that has destroyed and obliterated the Native White Tech Workforce.
These are some core things to think about when thinking about breaking about the US.
And I blame all this on the 1965 Immigration Reform Act…and I blame JFK for the passage of the 1965 Immigration Reform Act for the 1965 Immigration Reform Act was reprobate Teddy’s monument of permanent demographic destruction..
When America is decomposed in terms of race…well it will a lot’s of fun!!!! when the next round of locust plagues and dust bowls return. Last time these ecological doomsday events occurred in America a 90 percent majority White America was able to achieve Super Agreeability(a mathematical theorem somewhat a direct consequence of Helly’s famous theorem) on what to do policy-wise. Just wait when a racially decomposed post-America Universe comes into existence:Think Cormac McCarthy’s THE ROAD. There will be no Civic Nationalism solution…this was always a lie…
California is already a drought stricken desert stealing Colorado’s water for years. Just wait for the mega-droughts-civic regional nationalism won’t come riding to the rescue.
> California is already a drought stricken desert stealing Colorado’s water for years.
First, California has no pumping limits like the other states. that’s why they grow alfalfa in the desert Inland Empire and ship it to Saudi Arabia to feed their imported camels (from Australia).
Second, the snow pack in the Sierra’s can provide ample water and they can construct dams, drain the lakes in Tahoe, Clearlake etc for being self sufficient.
They don’t because, they have no pumping limits.
Water levels will determine the limits, power and water probably gets taken from plants before human consumption.
And there’s only so much falling water around as the expanded atmosphere soaks up the moisture like a sponge, only to drop it randomly in buckets on some unsuspecting far away land and sweep it down river to its new destination.
Everyone – can we get back on topic. Thanks. Mod.
The answer is simple – build big nuclear or solar or tidal powered sea-water desalination plants.
And a piping system.
From what Californians say, their government released a huge amount of fresh water (last spring, I believe) from their dams into the ocean – water enough for like 10 years (or some large number of years) and then announced water restrictions after they had greatly lowered the dams. So the government is heavily manipulating things against the people for its own agenda.
Okay it wasn’t 10 years, but it a minimum of 5 years, and all their reservoirs were filled to the brim until they started releasing the water in late 2020 and early 2021:
“Less than two years ago, every reservoir in the state was brimming with water, and held a supply to last a minimum of five dry years without another drop of rain. Shasta and Oroville by themselves held enough water to meet the needs of 80 million people for a year. With 25 million receiving water from these sources, those two reservoirs alone could deliver water for more than three years. But the majority of that stored water has been released to the ocean for ongoing environmental causes that have not benefitted a single endangered fish.”
> Tulsi is a fanatical supporter of the H1-L1B Visa Program
everyone’s favorite bogeyman. not sure you’ve looked into the requirements to get one of these and on top of it, what it takes for labor certification for adjustment of status. If these people did not come here and make the Apple’s and Microsoft’s and Google’s and Amazon’s the tech behometh’s they are today, thousands of software companies as offshoots and capturing the value chain for USA and delivering it in the stock market where your pension and 401K sits with expectations of unreasonable unsustainable yields, they’ll all be happy to go back where they came from provided USA is willing to send back the value they added, the taxes they paid, with interest and some.
Maximizing GDP and 401k returns should not be more important than preserving the integrity of your people and your nation. Much of the reason why America is so screwed up right now is due to the prevalence of this attitude amongst boomers; to paraphrase Lenin, “The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”
If we didn’t import workers to take jobs, then real Americans would eventually fill those positions. That is how a market works; when demand goes up, price goes up, which leads to supply going up.
> If we didn’t import workers to take jobs, then real Americans would eventually fill those positions.
while the rest of the world sits on it’s hands waiting for America to eventually fill those positions, so the rest of the world can enjoy the downstream benefits after the American worker is found, trained, paid and produces a product. and at what price?
havn’t you seen why China is the factory for the world? Americans just don’t want to work hard anymore. They want entitled cushy jobs, union pay and certainty and more money in their pocket for their fancy gizmos. All the while the rest of the world will sell them cheap cheap raw materials and finished products.
what world are you living in, btw?
China is able to undercut US production costs of consumer durables, because the cost of living is far higher in the US than China. The US monetary system creates all money as interest bearing debt, that the workforce has to borrow in order to pay student loans, buy a house, lease a car, cross a toll bridge and pay sales tax on everything they must buy, health insurance premiums, Social Security contributions, and pay the profit margins demanded by private businesses, that virtually control all legislation enacted by Congress.
By contrast, China creates its own money supply free of debt, that funds all infrastructure spending leading to far lower overhead costs. China does not need to save money for future expenditure, since it creates money with a computer keystroke on an as and when needed basis via its government owned central bank, without incurring debt to private banks.
We Americans don’t want to work hard anymore for an empire that is crushing us, dividing us and won’t give us our due. We will work hard for our own free society based on our constitutional rights and a truly representative government that isn’t 100% corrupted. If our billionaire overlords and evil politicians stand down with their greed and allow our self determination then you will get better, harder work from us Americans than from anyone else. That’s the world that I’m living in.
China is the factory of the world because the globalists intentionally offshored America’s productivity in order to decrease wages. China rising is a direct result of people like you who prioritize profits over nation and culture.
Tulsi has gone and I dont think she will come back unless she gets it together properly.
She won’t be allowed back. She’s effectively persona non grata in the Democratic Party and the mainstream media have likewise declared her anathema.
Short of a nuclear war, it’s hard to imagine the US getting to the point of disassociation. There are powerful forces that would oppose such a move with virtually unlimited resources and virtually unlimited violence, if need be.
Even the enormous upheavals of the Great Depression did not fracture the union. The two-party system helps- we’re always a year or two away from another election that might put the ‘other’ team in power so things might change.
I don’t really understand the breakup of the USSR though, to see if there are any plausible parallels. Can someone recommend a book or two that covers that in a reasonable way? We’re 30 years on, enough time for historians to get their ducks in a row.
Although it’s possibly not the book you have in mind, I would recommend “The Rise and Fall of the Great Powers” by Paul Kennedy. First published just a few years prior to the collapse of the Soviet Union, and very prescient in that regard.
One view of the fall of the USSR that I’ve come across is that it was a racial redistricting. The USSR had fallen to about 50% ethnic Russians, but after the collapse the Russian nation was about 80% ethnic Russian.
I agree w/ you about the powerful forces. I said in another post on this thread that they’d nerve gas a state and blame it on white supremacists before they’d let a state leave the union, and I don’t mean that as hyperbole.
> I don’t really understand the breakup of the USSR though,
different language, culture and tradtions. all bound together in an idealogy that was forced on them that they did not believe nor did it work. the centrifugal forces were always there till Russia, the overlord lost interest in propping up these countries and depleting her own wealth. If the west really wanted to finish off Russia, they should have propped up USSR till Russia was completely broke. what’s so hard to understand?
Here are a couple:
“Five Stages of Collapse” and “Reinventing Collapse: The Soviet Experience and American Prospects” both by Dmitry Orlov
Thanks, got them, will give them a read.
Books about Soviet collapse
Soviets Fates and Lost Alternatives – Prof. Stephen Cohen, one of the best, unbiased critics on the Soviet system.
No regions for dead native americans? How interesting. As one, I think this is still just Anglo-Saxon posturing and hegemony to funnel money into their racist pockets. We indigenous folks were important enough for the people you speak for to rob us of everything, to rape our women and our children….and there’s plenty of evidence these peoples are still raping and killing our children…..as interesting as this prospect is, I would exist just the same, outside of it and outside of time. We, as a people have no identifiable regional interest because it simply isn’t allowed. And you spend all your gelt…guilt….money on another subjugated race, as they unlike us, take their show into the street and force feed you with it. My race, sitting here watching you decimate yourselves with your science, and this continued racial exceptional drivel, will always lend a dark haunting in everything you undertake in this land. You can try and buy the blacks with glass beads but you can’t buy your way out of death. When you die in this land, we’ll be there for the meet and greet and brother, it will not be pleasant. Have a nice day.
the WASP monoculture still does not get it. thanks for this deep comment.
I thought of your people, Jimmy, when I read that “real Americans would eventually fill those positions.” Wondered who would be these “real” Americans.
Until america stops ignoring its native heritage, it will never be free.
Reconciliation with our native brothers and sisters should be the footing for our new nations.
You mean like worshipping entities like pachamama? Instead, let’s effect the 89.6 Project: in five years, to restore percentage of whites in America to 1946 level- 89.6%. A nation must have racial, cultural and religious unity to survive and prosper.
You know exactly what i mean Ted, (Personal insult removed,MOD)!
We stole their land and destroyed their culture.
Make america white again? What is this claptrap nonsense.
Your obviously not a regular here, russia as a nation understands its history and uses that history and experience . That is why their nation is strong and ours are weak.
Here we lie about history so we can make more money.
I feel sorry you hate brown and black peoples, but in reality they were here long befor our white ancestors got here. Mine have been here since early 1600’s. In contrast, the real.natives have been here for 100000 years or more.
And you want to hand America over to the Chinese…Hindus…Sihks….Muslims….and other nonwhites so they can enjoy the benefits of the European Conquest of North America…The sob story for the Amerindians will be flushed down the toilet as soon as the nonwhite Conquest of America is complete. By the way, you didn’t mention anything about that yummy Mancorn…You know what Mancorn is..right?
Did I mention that Ameridians are Democratic Party Voters? So they voted for Obama’s crimes in Donbass.
And your not from an immigrant family? Were ALL immigrants in north america unless your part of the native tribes that lived here pre colonisation.
Your point that nativrs voted for a black snake oil saleman is moot, obama lied like every other politician before and after him, doesnt change a thing!
Where is it written that america is ONLY for white europeeans? I mean seriously, what kind of fascist crap is that? Did you ever read the plaque on the statue of liberty?
I dont know what a mancorn is, please enlighten me.
I’m kinda outraged here, waiting for the handover of america to the brown peoples??? Id rather that than hand it over to a bunch of white english billionnaires. Oh wait , the WASP already own america.
I expected a smarter comment from you, not this white power trash.
No one on this side of the pond knew what was going on in donbass in 2014, and it dont matter who you vote for, they are BOTH war parties.
Hasent this blog taught you anything?
It’s not about hating others, it’s about loving your own. There are arguments that Europeans were here first (Solutrean Hypothesis, for example) but none of that matters. It’s just verbal gibberish to cover up the fact that the strong have always taken from the weak.
I understand what your saying, at the end of the day its like this. We have a few rich people controlling our lives. These rich people come up with new ways to keep us divided and fighting amongst ourselves, while they hide in the shadows laughing at us peons shooting ourselves in the foot daily.
Loving should bot be restricted to our own only. If Jesus taught us anything, everyone deserves love, and foegiveness for their sins, because HE took all our sins upon himself.
Now 2000 years later, look at what we have become, our we following our lord’s teaching? No were not. We cant selectively love for skin color or tribe or whatever.
Were different but were the same.
Clearly foreign forces are working to divide the US and it needs to realize who is the enemy.
And its not Russia, but Britain and elements of the EU. More specifically elites there.
They use these regional differences to divide and conquer.
Same as what is attempted in Russia and elsewhere.
The EU is nothing more than a Deep State colony run by Germany, full of brainwashed Eloi.
An those elites in UK & EU are the enemy of their own people.
Take WW2 – those behind Hitler didnt care about millions of German troops being killed and wounded and civilians being bombed etc… as long as they looted conquered territories and makes a $ out of war production.
They all sat in secured places and funneled the loot in to Switzerland.
Certainly not about the plight of Russians, Poles, Czechs etc…
Nothing has changed given the current situation.
The Market God requires more and more sacrifices. The word « sacrifice » means « to make sacred » and here, not surprisingly, it means to turn all Nature into commodities, even US. Many lost meaning, many lost common sense. We cling on what makes sense usually. These days, with so much uncertainty coming, many cling to the illusion bubble or try to get into another one… to preserve sanity, we turn irrational and delusional. Let’s face it, we are in a dead-end. Not only we are lost but we lost… The agonizing Empire is kicking like the beast 666 of the Apocalypse… Not a pleasant revelation… to realize we are “it”, the beast. We might still think righteously that the others are “it”, be it Chinese, Russians, blacks, immigrants… The “system” is by nature systematic and systemic. We are part of it but also it is part of us. That reminds me of the grieving process: first denial, then anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance. We may stand United as we experience disintegration. It is a journey. Lots to grieve about and lots to praise for. As far as the article, i see the need for the people to organize locally so we, the people, have somehow the means to disobey “outside mandates” and survive. That takes all kind of virtues and qualities. It takes a village. That said, are going feral or reinvent the wheel and rig a new system? I suggest two French writers. For the tribal model, the anthropologist Pierre Clastres describes very well the way power was dealt with. For a new system where/when the people are the subjective sovereign and the State its objective sovereign, I recommend Valerie Bugault as , not only she offers a model but she explains very well the prevailing present system. Understanding the present system is key.
“Divide and Conquer”.
A wise warning, Santiago: the same class of people who set up huge, powerful Global corporations are always keen to set up small, powerless nations.
The situation on the US is a mindset problem of urban Democrat ghettos and open spaced Republican / Libertarian states.
It does need to form regional blocks – where each has supreme powers.
And substantial checks & balances in them, and their own $ currencies where foreign interests cannot have any control and influence. (They will be forced into this in the end the way things are going).
And (perhaps ?) later a national confederation body but where it is extremely limited in powers and only covers things related to external or common things and cannot interfere with the regional Govts. And it have only a Senate of 10 Senators per State.
It is constant federal interference in member states that is the problem all over the world – US, EU & UK.
And that is tied in with wicked evil bankers.
Under such a situation the Democrat regions would go broke very quickly as they do not have the commodities and resources to stay afloat.
The chief problem at the moment for for the past century is foreign control of the US money supply and that must be addressed by total removal of influence from the UK & EU, except for the bare minimum needed to facilitate trade.
I’m one who was born and raised in the U.S.A., by parents from Germany. I’m fortunate to have roots on two continents. Many outside the U.S.A. think of “America” as some version of their own country; some land with a common culture. It simply is not. America, as I perceive it, is more like a boxing ring, or some Roman gladiator arena, where people come to take their chances in life. Some win, some loose, some find a niche and get comfortable. The only “culture” is the sense for adventure, the willingness to role the dice, and take life for all it has. If you’re not into it, “America” is not for you. Freud in his book “Civilization and its Discontents” noted a polarity in people of wanting their individual “freedom”, and the need for social conformity as a matter for survival. “America” appeals to the part of the person aspiring “freedom.” That sense for freedom, and the willingness to be in the ring is the only cohesion that exists in America, and not any sort of “cultural norm”.
The US never became independent in 1776. Until that date the colonies were under the direct control of the English crown, and after 1776 they became a banker entity. The American “revolution” of 1776 was led by Freemason George Washington who was on the Rothschild payroll. He never enjoyed the support of the majority of Americans in his “revolutionary” war. According to conservative historians a mere 7 % of “Americans” backed him, while according to liberal ones 25 % of the population backed him with another 25 % joining the British side. The remaining 50 % stayed neutral, trying to figure out what was going on. In 1776 there was no such thing as an “American”. After the war was over, you had the phenomena of emigration to Europe, with one commentator of the day stating that there was not a single village or town in England which did not have immigrants from the former colonies.
The US is still a banker entity, with the Rothschild’s leading the way. They control the US Federal Reserve, a private bank which has given its self the status of a central bank. It controls US finances.The HQ of the Freemasons is situated in Washington DC. It’s controlled from London. Some of the well known Freemasons in the US were George Washington, F.D.Roosevelt, Harry Truman, J.Edgar Hoover, etc. The current well known Freemason is Barack Obama, member of the Prince Hall Masonic Lodge for Afro-Americans. What this means is that the US political and financial establishment is London controlled, with the US fighting wars for the benefit of bankers and corporations.
Does the US have a future in it’s current geographic and political form ? Highly unlikely. It already had a civil war in 1861-1865, which was basically a conflict between the Germanic North and Celtic South. It’s a multi ethnic society. Some ethnic groups have assimilated and have become Americans, while others have not. As the saying goes in the US, different ethnic groups do not live together, but rather side by side.
Quite a number of analysts have raised the question if there is going to be another civil war in the US. That is virtually impossible, as today only 2 % of the population lives from agriculture and can directly feed its self, which was not the case in the mid 1800’s. Also, how many men would be willing to leave their families behind and fight in an internal conflict of the 1861-1865 type ? Very few indeed.
The US does not need a civil war to break up. The chief catalyst will probably be a financial crisis, which will see the dissipation of the Union, with Washington DC being helpless to prevent it.
The overview of London and the US shows how deeply entrenched the military and financial world is, and going back centuries. This does not appear to be so generally understood, but it raises many questions, including the thinking that UK is the poodle of Washington, or has been the belief, I have no idea what anyone thinks anymore. However on the streets of England and Scotland, whenever an international forum takes place the, cavalcades of limousines, aircraft, motorbike security, cordoned off areas, are looked on as though at another world, far from their own social, economic, and deteriorated environment.
Michael Hudson says something along the line of “when debt level becomes unpayable, it won’t be.” The empire is pretty much there now. What can the states do when the economic system collapses? Get together with neighboring states with similar, values, economy, history etc and create their own currency. Digital backed by gold. No to government run with money on which interest must be paid. The medieval church knew this. Usury impoverishes both the ruler and the ruled.
“Through works like these we can begin to see the main cultural materials with which we can build: for New England, the traditions of the east of England (Essex, East Anglia); for the South, the traditions of southwest England (Wessex, etc.), the borderlands of Scotland and England, Northern Ireland, and parts of Africa, France, and Spain; for the Great Plains, the German and Scandinavian cultures; for the desert Southwest, Spanish is a major influence; Hawai’i carries the traditions of the native Pacific islanders, and on from there.”
Oligarchs probably outnumber those who still partake in these cultures by a good four or five orders of magnitude.
America only has bars and churches everywhere. Differences are greater between urban and rural areas. It would be necessary to break up most of the states into several pieces, a few hundred different regions at least. So much power would have to be devolved so far down, that with the massive scale and high up-front capital costs required to implement most technologies it would be difficult to achieve even if it is possible and Wall $treet oligarchs and their lapdogs do not fight it every step of the way.
During the 2016 US election, as an outsider i took a really good look at US demographics and I was frankly stunned by the magnitude of the differences amongst the states. This difference is racial, religious and cultural. i think the miracle is that the USA has stayed together for so long, given the disparities. Only a common language, economic success and pride in being No 1 top dog militarily has kept the USA together. Take those away and disintegration becomes a certainty.
The groups of states i saw as practically incompatible:
1. The deep south – 40-60% black, very poor and essentially mendicants. Most are deeply protestant with only Louisiana being catholic. Not sure how the money works in the USA but these states will probably cling to the richer states if they receive money and assistance. Mississippi, South Carolina, Georgia, Louisiana, Alabama. 5
2. Obviously totally different to the south are the New England states – white and wealthy. Used to being the dominant elites they may decline in influence over time and will be deeply disillusioned. (Maine, Vermont, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Connecticut, Delaware, Maryland, New Hampshire and New York STATE not city. I could see these forming a functioning single entity, with close links to Canada and Europe. 8.5 (14)
3. The cascade states – already there are secessionist movements but Oregon, Washington possibly Montana and half of California might well separate BUT because of their location, I would see the central military body would fight very hard to not lose these states. Like New England these are very white. 3 (17)
4.The rust belt states. Once the core of USA strength much depends upon the ability of these states to regain economic power and influence. i think this relatively unlikely but as the most mixed or ethnically divers of the states, these could reemerge as the focus of a re-imagining USA or decline into a sort of mendicant hotch-potch. Thus Pennsylvania, Ohio, Indiana, Wisconsin, Illinois, Michigan face an uncertain future. 6 (23)
5. California, Nevada, Arizona and New Mexico could form a Spanish speaking grouping. looking West towards China, rather than East to Europe. 4 (27)
6. Then you have the flyover states. largely white and agricultural, these states could prove fairly cohesive even if some eg Utah are different. Utah, Idaho, Wyoming, Colorado, (maybe Montana), the two Dakotas, Nebraska, Kansas, Iowa, Minnesota, Kansas, Missouri – These could group together BUT they would be landlocked. 12. (39)
7. Texas and her neighbours – powerful and rich, Texas, Arkansas, Oklahoma. They would squabble over new Mexico. 3 (42)
New York city,plus New jersey could form a Singapore type of city state – ppwerful and rich. perhps they could unite with Florida as a retirement destination 2.5 (44)
8. Tennessee, Kentucky, Virginia, West V are harder to place
9. This just leaves the two distant ones and the protectorates. Hawaii could unite with California or become an independent state – perhaps the focus of some new great nation of Oceania. if not sold back to the Russians or Canada, Alaska culturally belongs with the flyovers I would have thought.
I am musing from afar. I assume there will be many comments.
Your list is interesting. Merge together 6 and 7 and they would do well.Endless arable farmland and the port of Houston. Armed population to boot. I would settle there.I am Canadian though but have travelled through several of these states.
Yes I think I agree – or at least it would make a powerful grouping.
I counted once just the population of 10 US states from Florida to Texas- 91 million people. Get that Midwest groupie in their as well and it could be quite powerful. A giant L shape carved out of the ruins.
Interesting list.Eastern WA and Eastern OR are much more like Idaho and Montana than the western part of their states. That’s why there are break away talks going on in both states. Add 6 and 7 and the Eastern parts of OR and WA, Montana, Dakotas and Idaho and there is quite a group. Ports(Texas) hydro power (Eastern WA and OR) Lots of agriculture. The remaining natives are pretty much there too. The Inner Turtle Island Federation is born!.
Your problem is your country is basically run by gangsters. This is because too many secretly admire them.
As long as Uncle Shumuel, the material owner of the land, is in control of all the facets of the US society no regional nationalism will be tolerated, even at the cost of a Civil War 2.0.
There are only three politically discrete regions in the USA:
(1) The Washington-Boston corridor, with outlying suburbs and exurbs, e.g.) extending as far as the Maine coast;
(2) A thin strip along the West Coast from Los Angeles to Seattle, with outlying suburbs and exurbs; essentially everything west of the San Andreas Fault;
(3) Everything else.
There’s no way to carve a viable “liberal” secessionist country out of this.
Of course there are large liberal enclaves in (3) , such as Chicagoland, the thin strip of Colorado Front Range, and Hawaii, but they also aren’t viable.
For all the hand-wringing on the part of “conservatives,” in any breakup scenario “liberals” are screwed well and good.
The USA will eventually collapse, and probably in my lifetime (I’m middle-aged), but it won’t collapse into regions; it will collapse down to the neighborhood level. If we’re lucky.
I get what you are saying and you could be right in the short term, but even given chaos at the micro level, coalescence into larger units is bound to happen.
The key as always is economics. if the economic crisis is severe enough, anything can happen. Much depends on transport routes and supplies. My point was really that the blocks I mentioned are sociologically compatible with people moving between them easily. if say one group are richer than others they may join together to keep less fortunate people out.
True enough, but it won’t be “liberals” coalescing into larger units. They will be wiped out because they have no firepower to speak of.
‘a homogenous cultural identity?’
Again isn’t life about family? Family and community and on the issue of community I once heard a Pastor of a Church i attended confess he didn’t know what community looked like. To that I replied I have an interesting story for you from my youth. A Greek lady I worked for named Tassia told us about something that went down in Greece when she was a teenager. In some village there was a family who everyone thought had some family member overseas because they were always getting care packages and gifts. They were quite well off compared to everyone else so looked up to in a way and respected. Until that is the day arrived when a couple arrived from America in the village which sent the entire family into a kind of frenzy. The man of the house in fact disappeared leaving his poor wife and children to deal with the outcome. What was the outcome the couple were missionaries, Jehovah’s Witnesses, who wanted to set up through this couple who they supported financially in the hopes of creating a missionary work and Church in this community. When the Orthodox Father showed up wanting to know what the convulsion was all about and who these strangers were and learning the truth about this man and his family well as Tassia said that family lost everything they had. The man they beat him for bringing such shame to their community and church and that was the end of that.
That my dear Pastor is what community looks like! He just rolled his eyes in silence.
On another matter I think we can summarize America if not Europe really quite well with the words from Christ, a kingdom divided against itself will never stand.’
I live in a Bible Belt and when I fist moved here it was quite a shocking experience the numerous Churches all divided by theological dogmas. It’s actually quite stupid in many ways and I have often said and argued wouldn’t it be so much better if Churches in such a multicultural west were divided by culture? Like here is the Greek Church of Christ, there the Russian Church, there the British Church, there the German Church, there the French Church etc, etc…But no we have instead the free baptists, the covenant and so on. I even wanted once to visit a Reformed Calvinist Church just to see how they conducted themsleves and what not. A dear friend from Holland pleaded with me not to do it. He said Gerry believe me you will create serious incident and they wonèt even let you in the front door. O, come one i said you have got to be joking, exaggerating. I never seen fear cross his face and convinced me stay away. Some time later at a new job i met a fellow employee who belonged to that Church and is of the firm belief they are the only true Christians. lol He died picking up a disease of some kind in New Guinea on a missionary trip.
Short of divine Intervention im afraid the West is finished period.
Your piece connects very well with my astrological musings in the forefield of the latest November-bail.
My last sentence then: “For the American soul, to heal is hence necessary to found a new American federation, and by anyone who in his soul has founded it, the collective act, to free Turtle Island, is done, an American stranger living in harmony with his land , but alienated from the presumptuous USA of of 1776.”
And my piece contains the current 7-years-Septar (rhythmic horoscope) since 2019, containing the 6 remaining days of the US- 7-month’s- M a r s – period. Neptune period then will follow since 11.17.2021 for 7 months. Instead of provocation, 7 months dissolution.
Wow, just came across some interesting pieces on tomorrows possible breakup of America termed texit about a push for Texas to leave the union:
There is currently a petition by the Texas National Movement to separate from the US that has been supported by 422,238 people at the time of this writing. The website declares:
“TEXIT means that Texans determine our own laws and not 2.5 million unelected bureaucrats in Washington. It means that we get a government that begins and ends at the borders of Texas. It means an end to the giant sucking sound of $103-$160 billion dollars per year being siphoned from the pockets of Texas taxpayers. Most importantly, it means that for the first time in our lives we control our own destiny.”
and look at this regarding immigration having a political agenda? The world does indeed live in a ‘global village.’ Read and weep I guess?
It has been argued that Biden intends to grant 11 million illegal aliens citizenship to tip the balance of power to the Democrats. Some fear that this may be as much as 20 million, and the Democrats hope this will end the Republican Party. I have told the story of how I was negotiating for Hong Kong to try to buy land in Australia. I met with former Prime Minister Paul Keating, who was Secretary of the Treasury at the time. After much frustration of not being able to get a deal, I asked if this was a racist issue. He replied, no. If he let the people from Hong Kong in, they would vote conservative and change the balance of political power, for he was Labour. I have first-hand knowledge of how they look at immigration solely on the political mix. This is all about wiping out Republicans and creating a welfare-dependent society that gives them the authority to oppress those who actually produce. https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/politics/biden-administrations-preparing-to-rig-the-2022-election-as-directed-by-soros/
It may look like the intent of immigration is to wipe out the Republican party but I suspect there is something less obvious at work. Although there are some minor differences both parties have the same agenda which is the installation of the New World Order. Massive immigration causes dissension among the populace and stresses the social service network. MSM milks this constantly. Massive immigration is a way to distract from the real evil which is the loss of privacy, restriction of personal freedom and the increasing trans humanism.
If the various regional nations within the “United” States declare their independence from the USA, it would only be a case of the chickens coming home to roost.
After all, the USA has been sponsoring secessionist movements or trying to baklanize dozens of nations around the world like the former Yugoslavia, Sudan, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Venezuela, Iran, China, Russia, etc….
It is only appropriate that the Disunited States of America finally receives its just desserts and reaps domestically what it has sown abroad.
For a new Declarations of Independence *from* the United States of America.
10 Separatist Movements In The United States
Re ” the progressive cultures of New England and the West Coast and the more conservative/traditional cultures of the South and Midwest; ”
I read all of these fouindational texts years and years ago.
The current major divide is political (not regional “cultural”), namely red vs. blue.
Although state governments have been captured by one color or the other, the truth is that most of the states are purple, with small blue islands in the more urbanized areas, surrounded by red.
So a neat little separation is hardly possible at this point. That horse left the barn three or four or five decades ago.
Which I really heartily regret.
Note, also, that Joel Garreau’s book, which I read when it came out in I think 1989, is about all of North America (and the Caribbean), not just the USA. With the direction CAnada is going, it no longer looks like a place that any portion of the USA should want to be joined up with (e.g., New England with the Maritimes). This was not the case in the 1980s. In the 17th -19th centuries the organic connections between the new England states and the Maritimes were very strong.
It has been noted that the Civil War wasn’t really a civil war because the basic dividing line was geographical.
Accepting this idea for the sake of discussion, then the American Revolution was more of a civil war than the actual Civil War. And a contemporary effort to separate according to region would probably end up being another genuine civil war, with some groups being forced to flee to other areas of the country because red and blue inhabit the same general geographical areas—each is like a cancer in the other’s flesh.
Maybe Texas can pull off a secession–because Texas is already the size of a small country and is like a country within a country with its own “national” consciousness, and is located on the border plus has access to open sea. It might pull Louisiana with it, except for the racial issues that would immediately interfere with a clean break for Texas.